Code of Ethics

Welcome to the Leading Lane podcast for Real Estate Pros by Real Estate Pros, with your hosts, Ashley Frederick and Steven Burch. If you're looking for an honest, authentic, and raw perspective, you found is. Welcome, everyone, back to our Leading Lane podcast. It is the end of August, and so if you're in real estate, you know that the last week and a half has been maybe a little bit more interesting than what we would all like to see, but lots of learning curves. I think a lot of us are trying to work through all these. But what I've really come to see in the last maybe two weeks are a lot of violations, a lot of code of ethics violations. Not necessarily just to do with the changes as of August 17, but just in general. And I think what I wanted to kind of delve into with you, Steven, is why. Why people are so afraid to maybe turn some. Turn other agent in. And it's not like I want that to come across the wrong way as far as, like, we need to turn everyone in. But I think that there are definite, definite teachable moments, which I like to call other agents and be like, hey, I'm not sure if you knew this, because most of them didn't, but then there are, like, clear lines in the stand, like, can't do that. And so I think maybe if we just had an open discussion about, like, what warrants that, what we can do better as an industry, because really, like, we all need to help one another, but there's also just points where things are maliciously done. Yeah. And, you know, I think unpack this is that it's scary that we are seeing these types of things. It's scary that people in the industry do not know that about the lawsuit. They don't know. They don't know what in the world is going on. So I think first it's. It's a show of. Maybe that's the reason why realtors have such a bad rap is because we have so many people that are out there operating like this. And again, I want to echo that. Like, we're not talking that you need to go and, you know, report everybody and be a. Karen. What. What I'm saying is we have. If we're trying to raise the standard in this industry, we have to hold each other accountable, and we have to make sure that we first start that by being the leader and creating a teaching opportunity. But if they are blatantly and consist continually to go against that, we can't continue to allow people to operate that way. We have a duty to the public to be able to protect them. And that is by removing people that should not have a license and be selling real estate and not adhering to the code of ethics means that they should not be a realtor. Right. So to answer your question, like why are people scared? A. It's a. A lot of people don't like confrontation, right. They don't want to start something and you know, then all of a sudden they're wrapped up into this. And um, maybe, maybe also too it's. They don't understand what the true process is to be able to report is. Right. And I think it's important to be able to say, you know, specifically with real estate, like we have the real estate commission that has our license. So those are actic acting real real estate professionals right there. They don't have to adhere to the code of ethics. We opt in to nar into the association. So we have the code of ethics on top of law that we have to adhere to as well. So when, when we say report, there's really two different avenues to report. One is directly to the real estate commission for the licensing law. One is directly to the association. That is going to be the ethics side of things. So the way that I like to do is, right, wrong or indifferent, and is depends on what is actually is. There was a scenario in real life that happened with one of the agents that was with my company and they did things completely unethically, illegally when they, when they left our company. So because is was illegal and blatant and involved now another third party company, I submitted everything directly to the real estate commission and from the real estate commission, once that came back and they deemed that yes, is was actually against the law, they revoked his license. Then I took is to the code of ethics as well to be able to then move forward with that process too to ensure that if in the future is was ever reactivated that is was noted that he was doing illegal and unethical items on there. So I try to make sure that I'm strategic, like what is the, the outcome here? Like that was blatantly wrong and illegal. Like I'm not going to allow that. But on the ethics side, you know, being able to start a grievance people, I don't know why they're, they're afraid. I mean, it's kind of funny. I mean I think. Well, and I think there's. Let's also say that sometimes code of ethics violations or thoughts are unfounded. Right. So a lot of times people can just have upset feelings or Whatnot and they might think that that's the next step. And I think that that's a, that's a hard thing between like public and realtors, understanding true duties, those types of things. But I think I'm more like when is comes to like actual agents, like when we're, when you're agents and you're dealing with another agent and things are unethical, like why we just kind of sweep is under the rug. And I, I think a lot of times it's just because, at least in my area, I think it's because that's just the way that it's always been. So know, you just kind of. Oh well, they just always do that. Like they're. Before we switched over to Supra lock boxes, the big thing was that a realtor would give her code or key code out to buyers and they could let themselves in the house. And everyone just, everyone just knew that and thought that is was okay. And I remember a buyer called and was like, well like she gave me her code, so I'm just going to go in. And I was like, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa. Can't, can't do that. You know, And I think, I think that's really what is is, is it's just maybe people don't take is as seriously, which frustrates me. You know, like just last week we had somebody directly call one of our sellers to tell them that they thought that their home was underpriced. And I mean I like stopped in my tracks as far as how one would even think as another realtor, like to call another seller and, and call, you know, a seller that's not yours and have that discussion like blows my mind, you know, and then when you do potentially reach out to the, you know, other broker, it's just like, oh well, they didn't mean is, you know, no big deal. Maybe next time, you know, we'll, we'll, we'll treat them for next time. And I think it's just the fact when is keeps on going on and on and on, you know, it's, is is frustrating to me and that real estate takes a, you know, 72 hour course to get your real estate license. But yet what you actually need to know is years worth of knowledge. Right? And right like 12 years, then I still don't know everything. And I think that's what people forget is that you can take this test that doesn't actually mean that you've like done the tried and true and maybe always understand and sometimes we get is Wrong. And that's where I think it's a good thing. Like, I've tried to help other agents when it's not malicious things or not illegal things, you know, like a typo or somebody put out like a tour too early before is was listed. Like it's just a simple phone call or text message. Like, hey, I know you probably didn't mean to do this. And right. For part, part of me it's. We talk about being their broker before you are their broker. So if it's things that we can, you know, again, just small things that can be corrected that someone didn't know. But it's just these, you know, malicious or like bad things that people are doing. And I'm just so confused. And like right now it's a matter of steering. Right? We are having a big discussion about what steering looks like. And I think, you know, the fact that some people are just kind of blowing that off to the side that, you know, I don't have to show properties and they're getting, I guess what we talk about like commission breath again. Like, I guess is just makes me frustrated as to like, this is the whole reason that we're in these situations and why people give realtors a bad name is because we're not holding each other accountable, which we should do in any industry really. And you know, I think another part of is too, like is, is the leadership that they're under. Let that be from a broker level or even at an agent level. Like, you know, in. I'm gonna flip here too. Like, is may be the comprehension of that individual and what kind of investment are they really doing? They may be under fantastic leadership, but the agent never shows up to be able to get the. Receive the training right. Or they may be there and they're not paying attention. They're not, you know, they're. They're out there on the whim versus being held accountable. And you know, I do. It's never comfortable to be able to say, hey, you know, like, you're, you're doing this wrong. And there. Everybody has the right to run their business and operate their business however they choose. And that's the prerogative. But at the end of the day, I'm not going to subject myself to and put myself in a legal issue just because you choose to run your business like that. You know, we have a broker that refused to. To submit the offer, present the offer to their seller because we had commission in the contract. So I said, get is to me in writing and legit. They Wrote me an email saying that they're refusing to put that in, I mean, Smith offer. Like, that's illegal. That's unethical. Like, you can't, you cannot do that. How is that in the seller's best interest? Absolutely. And you put is in writing again, you know, like, so I, I think it's just, is shows, you know, taking that opportunity. And you know, we talked about is in our sales meeting with the rest of our agents. Like, look, this is happening here on a local level, like, and in writing. And it's a broker. Yeah. And so at that point, like, if this is what the type of stuff that we're dealing with, what else is out there? So let's take this as a learning opportunity for ourselves. What did we do wrong? Right. And you know, how do we go about this in the future? But if you don't have those conversations, real life conversations to be able to showcase to your team, I call them, you know, throw under the bus conversations, like not divulging information on who said what or whose transaction, if they choose to, that's on them. Um, but like they need to know, be on the lookout for these types of things constantly. And these are brokers. And just because they bark does not mean that they're right. Just because they're loud does not mean they're correct. Just because they've been in this for 102 years does not mean that they know exactly what the way to do is. Like, you need to educate yourself. You need to make sure that you know the laws, you know the code of ethics. And I truly believe, and this is 100%, like when I first started in real estate, I was so young and I had this complex in my mind. Nobody wants to hire, you know, 20 some year old to go buy or sell real estate because I don't have the knowledge. So what I did was I read the law front, back, left, right. Like I read the ethics, I read our contracts and I knew is in and out. And when those situations came about that I had somebody on the other side, you know, throw a fit or do something wrong, I was able to reference and be able to say, here is exactly where it's at. This isn't my opinion, this is law that both of us pass the same test for. Like you are doing is incorrectly. And that is how I believe that I built a solid foundation on how to grow my company and grow myself, because I knew the, the workings of all the laws and everything else. Like, I'm not saying I'm an attorney by any means. But I at least had enough foundation and knowledge to be able to articulate is and, you know, utilize the resources that are available to prove my point was, you know, accurate. So I think it's education all the way. All the way. That's what like we've been focusing on. Just because the last week and a half has been, I mean, difficult because like in our market we're maybe not doing things quite the same as everyone else. And you know, I get nasty phone calls and emails sent out about me like to other brokers, which, I mean at this point in time I just laugh about. But like the brokers that have picked up the phone and called me, I've like literally said you have to educate yourself. I am more than happy to send you all of these videos, all of these things that will make you understand why we're doing is. Just this weekend we had a, an agent call one of our agents, you know, air that they can't get paid and they don't know how to get paid and they're going to, you know, look at giving up real estate. And it's just, I don't understand. And again, I was, you know, it's hard to educate people like that aren't in your own office too. Right. Like, we can only educate other agents so much if they're not getting is from their own office. But that's what I've just told all of our agents is we have to do the best that we can to educate them as to why, why we're interpreting this way and that in really the big scheme everything should still be able to work itself out just fine. But you know, the same conversation I had with a broker a week ago is like, why are you running around with a sub agency form? Like, why are you running around with someone that doesn't want to have a guaranteed relationship with you? Like that there's no self worth there. And why are you having your agents not put value to themselves? And so I think that that's a hard struggle for people. And then I do think that sometimes when people get desperate is when they start doing things that aren't kosher. And I think that, you know, for, for all of us it's always to me like when something feels wrong inside, right? Like that's when you're like, that doesn't feel right. So if is doesn't feel right, it's probably not right. Right. You know, but I always tell my agents, like if something doesn't feel right, just pick up the phone and call Me, because there's probably a reason you feel that and we can get to the end of is versus, you know, people can make really bad decisions on a whim because they didn't ask anyone or they thought they knew is. And that's the other thing is, right, like we're all human. We all make mistakes, which I fully am aware of. And that's not what I'm saying. I think it's just when we get into these really bad ones, like where you're trying to steer or you're, you're not letting people into homes or you're calling other people sellers, like, these are just really bad things that are like 101 in real estate that we should not be doing right. And, and again, it's scary. I don't even have another word to describe some of the stuff that, you know, we're seeing other than scary. So freaking scary. On, like, what in your mind made you decide that was a good idea? Like, there's no red flag there. Like you didn't have a person, you know, on your shoulder telling you no, like, where. What is going on? And then is just makes me think, like, if they're doing this, what else again, are they doing wrong? And are they. They're going to land themselves in a lawsuit real freaking quick. Right? Going a different direction with this. Like right now, I'm taking the opportunity. Like, this is recruiting mode. This is recruiting mode. Really be able to educate the people, be the broker before your. Your broker or before you are their broker. And if you've done that for a long time now, is shouldn't be as difficult to be able to reach out and say, hey, you want to educate yourself on this? Like, let me help you. And I'm identifying. I can't talk today. Identifying those people as my BS agents right before Steven, because they don't have the, the knowledge yet to be a great agent. They may be great humans and could have the potential, but if they still remain under where they are under that umbrella, like, they may not make is. And I want to try to capture those people and those people that are also maybe under leadership that doesn't. Isn't listening to what the mandates are and adhering to the changes and still continue to operate under their own opinion, even though all of these changes have already occurred and been pushed down to us. So it's a great opportunity to jump in front of those other agents and start trying to recruit them, getting over to your company. And I really think that this is the time to be able to Start truly growing brokerages because people are so thirsty for that knowledge and they're not getting is. Yeah, I think you make a great point. I mean, it's kind of like a. It's like a open market right now. I mean, if you're an agent somewhere and one, you don't know what we're talking about, then you definitely need to reach out, you know, to your local association, etc. But secondly, I mean, if you're in a place of somewhere that you know isn't full of knowledge, isn't offering you training, isn't trying to help you determine your value and you know, how to do buyer consults and why we value ourselves. I mean, it's. If this is your career, I mean, this is what you do every day for a living, and you should be putting time and money sometimes into your education and sometimes is. You know, I think that we've talked about this before, but change is hard. Change is hard as far as contracts. Change is hard as far as moving brokerages. Like, we've both done is. But in the same sense, like, I look at where I'm at today and I wouldn't trade is for the world, for the knowledge that we now have and, you know, kind of being a front runner in all of this new changes. But same thing, like, there is a point of just really sitting with where you're at and does is align with your values and are you getting the training and education that you need? And if not, is might be time to, you know, see what other areas there are within your market. Because I can guarantee you there's in at least every market, there's got to be some agents that have been pushing. And I mean, I know in our area, like, there's others outside of our area that have been very boisterous on, you know, helping others and whatnot. So I think it's important to reach out to those people. They don't have to be with your brokerage. Like I said, I had calls with other agents from other brokerages trying to help them understand. But to me, it's also like, this didn't happen overnight, right? This change wasn't like, oh, we're gonna make this change. I mean, we've been talking about is for like, 18 months. A lot of other people were like, no, we just started talking about is 30 days ago. And again, like, what rock are you? Are you under that your brokerage isn't helping you this with these things, right? And you know, at the end of the day, like, I think that. Not. I think I know we are under the best leadership with Next Home. Right? And I mean, shout out to James Dwiggins. Like, I know everywhere he is, everywhere he is on top of his stuff. And I'm so thankful because if we were still an independent company and even with a previous franchise, but like, as an independent company, I don't know what we would be operating as. Right. I think that we would probably one of the people that we're talking about right now of, you know, head under the rock, because I wouldn't have been paying attention. I wouldn't have known to. But James and the corporate team have been on top of this topic the entirety time. Like, and I think also here too, as a leader, it's great that, you know, we have to express the stuff to our agents when we learn is, not hold on to and model is. Like, imagine if we did not talk to our agents about this and we only popped is up, you know, to them and brought is to their attention 30 days ago, like some of these other people. I think it's so important when you have those little, hey, red flags. I don't know how this is going to unfold, but I just want to make sure that we're all prepared. Let's have a conversation about is. So you're not going to get these surprise emails at the last minute. I mean, for ours, is was five days and our association ripped all of our contracts without telling us. So then go to completely new ones. But imagine all the rest of people out there that had that same experience not having any guidance or anything else. Like, I don't know how some of these people are going to be able to continue. Like, well, I tell my agents I apologize because sometimes I feel like I bombard them, like daily with, this is new. This came out today. This is what we're doing. But again, like, education is power. But you're right. I mean, another great podcast is the unfiltered podcast with James and with Keith. And they dive deep. You know, they're in these lawsuits, they are in these courtrooms, they're talking to these lawyers. If you want another perspective that you haven't heard, I strongly suggest that you hop on that. And I think that it's, you know, the great thing about James is that he's not just focused on next time. He's focused on the industry as a whole. And that's why he's going to all these places and, you know, sends us links. Like, if you need a link to share this to someone not in next home, like, please Share this link and I think that's where we're talking is is comes from education. But you have to be willing to take on the education, you have to be willing to soak is up. But then you also just have to be willing to, you know, kind of stand up for the things that aren't going well and the people that aren't following along or aren't willing to learn new ways. Right? And you know, on our call, you and I were on a call directly with, with James and I asked him, you know, hey, like, what does is feel like? You know, how do you, how do you handle being this person at the top, going against the grain, but the right way against everybody else? Like, what does that look like for you? And he, I mean, I think he said like verbatim, like, hey, you guys know, success, you know, and being at the top, like, is lonely, right? And he is not afraid to voice his opinion and go against the grain of everybody else and provide a different perspective. But he then followed up with, then it's gonna be hard at the beginning, but then other bit, everybody else is gonna start looking to you because you are the one that has been vocal. You are providing knowledge, right? Like, and you're not just giving your opinion about things, like you're being able to support is. Then it's going to be easier later on as this goes through. Because I know that there's things that he has been talking about that definitely is not the normal, you know, standard. And we implemented a lot of different things that he suggest suggested and you know, we're getting shade from people. But at the end of the day, I truly believe we are going in the right direction and eventually they're going to start complying and doing the same way that we're doing is now. We're just the first ones in this new territory, but we're able to pave the path for everybody else. So I keep on telling our agents, right, like, is, as difficult as is is, we're going to lead from the front. And sometimes, you know, that's hard because, you know, there's no, no necessarily steps to follow. But if we feel is in our hearts that we're doing the right thing, we are. We will lead from the front. And I think you're right. I think that, you know, 90 to 180 days from now, things will look different than they look today. And some of those agents and brokers might be like, oh, like that's what you were talking about. That's what why? And I hope they Come around because at the end of the day, like, we all accomplish more by working together. And so just trying to, you know, maybe not go against the grain, which is what we feel like we're doing. But if you could just be aware of, you know, again, you have to be aware of what's going on outside of your little city, too. So just because your little city might do is one way, that's not necessarily the right way. So you have to be fully aware of reality and know that this is on a national level. Right, right. And, you know, like, I reach out, I last week I texted a few handful of other brokers and I just said, hey, checking in on you. Are you doing okay? Right. Like, people are frustrated and I think when there is the unclarity that is there, they. They do make some calls that, you know, maybe went against their. What they should be doing. Um, but I'm. I'm going more on, like, okay, yeah, on the business side, professional side of things, they. They weren't really doing what they're supposed to. But imagine how this now trickles over into the personal life that. That frustration is going to come over, like, and is is lonely at the top. So if you don't have anybody else that is in your office or, you know, whatever else, like, I think it's so important just to say, like, how are you as a human? You doing all right? Right. Like, it's. This shit is tough, it's not fun. And, you know, like, I just want to make sure you're doing a okay and that's is. And what they choose to do with is at that point is on them. But, you know, I really wanted to reach out to, you know, a good amount of people just to make sure that they know that they're not alone, because we're not getting the leadership from our association whatsoever, in my opinion, local or state. So it's a number. I mean, power is in the numbers. And the more that you can be educated with is, like you said, equals more confidence. So competence equals confidence. And I want to make sure that I'm working with confident and competent people on the other side of our transactions so that we don't get drug in the lawsuit with them. So I think it's empowering multiple people on multiple different levels, regardless of if it's going to truly pay out for us. It's helping people at the end of the day. Good. All right, thanks for tuning in today. To our podcast, please go like subscribe and follow us and we will see you next time. If you've enjoyed today's episode, please like subscribe and share with others. Stay connected for more genuine insights and strategies to boost your real estate career on Facebook or check out our website. We'll see you next time.